– Talking to Morihiro Saito Sensei, Part 3
September 1, 2017 Christopher Li 2 Comments
Morihiro Saito and Morihei Ueshiba in Iwama
“Traditional Aikido – volume 2”
While he was working for the former Japan National Railways, Morihiro
Saito Sensei lived in the Iwama Dojo compound, taking care of O Sensei and the
Aiki Shrine and teaching in the Iwama Dojo. Sensei was devoted to O Sensei and
for this I respect him. I often met Saito Sensei when I accompanied O Sensei to
Iwama and during preparations for the Aiki festival. O Sensei was always there,
so I don’t have any memories of taking any of Saito Sensei’s classes.
O Sensei was more than 75, so his techniques and movements had
fully matured. Kisshomaru Sensei wasn’t around, and the techniques and
movements changed. In one direction, Saito Sensei absorbed completely the
movements and techniques that O Sensei had taught when he was healthy and
strong. Since O Sensei lived in Iwama which had the Aiki Shrine as well, I
think in that context it is proper to speak of
“preserving the traditional Aikido of Iwama.” The Iwama Dojo was located in a
large garden-like compound which was needed to practice ken and jo. O Sensei
would teach ken and jo however he felt inclined, and then the next day would do
something completely different. It was owing to the genius of Saito Sensei that
an easy to understand system of teaching jo and ken was established. My dojo’s
Igarashi Sensei cooperated with Saito Sensei’s publication of his book on jo
and ken. When I was shown the first edition of the book, I noticed there was no
photograph of O Sensei. I said something about this to Saito Sensei and he
replied that he had no good photographs of O Sensei. Good photographic
equipment wasn’t so readily available in those days. In the second edition
appears photographs of O Sensei which I gave to Saito Sensei.
With this kind of connection, Aikido Kobayashi Dojos have
incorporated regular ken and jo practice. Saito Sensei highly praised us for
this. Today, in overseas seminars, everyone has their own jo and ken; this is
Saito Sensei’s legacy.
Yasuo Kobayashi talking about Morihiro
Saito in “Aikido,
My Way“
Morihiro Saito Sensei was born on March
31st, 1928 and passed away on May 13th, 2002. For more than twenty years during
that time he trained directly under Aikido Founder Morihei Ueshiba, one of his
closest and longest serving students.
Morihiro Saito acted as the guardian of
the Aiki Shrine until his passing in 2002. He is famous for his dedication to
preserving the exact form of Morihei Ueshiba’s techniques as he was taught them
during his training under him in Iwama.
This is the third section of the
English translation of a three part interview that originally appeared in
“Answers from Budoka” (“Budoka no Kotae” / 武道家の答え), published by BAB Japan in
2006. You may wish to read Part 1 and Part 2 before reading this section.
Morihiro Saito – “Traditional Aikido – volume 2”
Budoka no Kotae – Talking to Morihiro Saito Sensei, Part 3
Q: Was it possible that he had some goal in mind?
A:
No, that’s not it. He was angry. Because even though he would tell them to
practice precisely and sharply they would only do flowing training. It annoyed
them when the Founder said that and scolded them, so they would call and say
“Saito-san, tell him that something came up and call him (the Founder) home”.
When O-Sensei was there they’d say “That annoying old man is here”. So the
Founder’s feelings finally snapped and he stopped teaching there.
Q: Something like “Respect from a safe distance” (敬して遠ざける)?
A:
That’s right. For that reason, when he returned here he would stamp his feet
and yell. Things like “Unacceptable!” (なっとらん!).
Ni-Dai Doshu Kisshomaru Ueshiba at Aikikai Hombu Dojo
The establishment of Hombu style
Q: How did things get that way?
A:
I believe that it was caused by the sudden emergence of Aikido into the world
after the end of the war. Because those demonstrations showed it in a really
beautiful manner. For that reason people flocked to Aikido, and since they
showed those people flowing movement everybody was happy. So because of that
people said that Aikido is an enjoyable Budo, it’s beautiful, it’s smooth and
attractive.
So
Hombu Dojo, for that reason, had a temporary golden age. During that time
people who were second or third dan scattered across the world. They said that
they wanted to make a name for themselves. That is the Hombu Style that
foreigners talk about. I followed another path of static training without doing
that, so people around the world call that Iwama Style. They became
international terms. A division that came about inside the same Aikido.
“Iwama Style” is first known overseas
Q: Is Iwama Style something special?
A:
Some people don’t like it, you know, those from Tokyo. Or even from the country
areas. So there are a lot of enemies. Even though when one speaks of Iwama
Style one is speaking of the Founder’s style…
Q: Was it the same overseas?
A:
However, I was rescued by the discovery of that book by the Founder. That
book…that researcher into the history of Aiki from America, he found it in the
countryside. That book proved that what I am doing is correct.
Morihiro Saito teaching from the 1938 technical manual “Budo“
Q: You must have been happy?
A:
I was ecstatic! That’s why i carry that copy, and wherever I go I show it to
people and say “There you are! Look at this, this is how I am teaching you”.
When you compare the training, in the end it slaps them in the face. Aikido
began from this Founder, and when you explain this clearly everybody is happy.
There was someone from Switzerland who came the other day, tomorrow someone
from Canada, they’re throwing away the techniques that they’ve been learning
for fifteen years and starting over again from the beginning. I really have to
give them credit.
Q: It’s significant that they even had the strength to make that
realization, isn’t it? How about the Japanese instructors?
A:
As you might expect, one issue is that without financial strength, making the
changeover is difficult. Other than that, there are doctors, people running
companies, and people who have their own jobs who are realizing that this is
different from the Aikido that they have done previously and are devoting
themselves to making a changeover. For that reason, I take precisely what I was
taught by the Founder, make it easy to understand, and have them study it.
Q: Will you publish a book about that some day?
A:
I’m thinking about it.
Q: Who is this? (pointing to the Founder’s book)
A:
The Founder used that name at times. He’d use the name Tsunemori (常盛) or Moritaka
(守高), but the name that appears in his family register is
Morihei (盛平).
Q: Is this the original?
A:
No, it’s a copy.
Q: I see, the reproduction is very good. Is there an original
copy someplace else?
A:
This name here is the name of the person to whom it was given. This was not
made public in Tokyo. Perhaps the Ueshiba family has it.
This
book is proof that I have been practicing honestly, Ha-ha-ha, it really helped
me out. From that time I carry it with me whenever I go out in the world,
Because from here this has changed again. I can explain the changes.
Morihiro Saito – “Traditional Aikido – volume 3”
Tales
of experiences with Aikido (武勇伝)
“Train
sincerely in the basics – the power found in them is kokyu-ryoku, Ki is there,
Ki is extended, this will be the result.”
Q: By the way, this is a lower level question, but this book is
targeted at a general readership who will be happy even with a casual
discussion, so may I ask you some of those types of questions?
A:
Even now we use these training methods, so in the end I think that I would like
people to enjoy what they are reading.
Q: Yes, that’s right, isn’t it? For example, if you will excuse
me, if you have some stories of a time that you were caught up in a fight
related to Aikido, or a “tale of heroism” (武勇伝), or a story of a spiritual experience, then I would like to ask
you about them.
Aikido Journal Editor Stanley Pranin translating for Morihiro Saito
A:
I don’t know what you mean by spiritual, but Aikido training has conditioning
in breath power (“kokyu-ryoku”), this is an extremely logical method of
expressing power.
One
night at Chichibu Station there was a fireworks display. About twenty people
missed their chance to ride the last train and were in the station’s waiting
room.
At
that time someone who looked like a yakuza grabbed a young man wearing a
business suit by the lapels and started pushing him around. So I said “Hey you,
stop that!”, but he wouldn’t stop! Then when I grabbed the arm of the person
who looked like a yakuza he let go of the other person and started grappling
with me. So I took a step back, put my hand slightly under his chin and went to
throw him. When I swept him with my right leg he flew straight backwards and
hit his head on the concrete – he lost consciousness. The railway police came right
away, so I passed him over to them.
That
kind of kokyu-ryoku is what people talk about when they say things like “extend
Ki”, but in the end Ki isn’t something special. Train sincerely in the basics –
the power found in them is kokyu-ryoku, Ki is there, Ki is extended, this will
be the result. When entering through theory without doing the actual techniques
one cannot really realize this.
Q: If that is done, when a person surpasses a certain level will
they be able to flip an opponent’s body over lightly just by touching them?
A:
That’s if one is following the principles strictly, and if the situation at the
time allows for it.
People who can match that skillfully with whatever technique is being used are skillful at Aikido. The person who takes the angle rationally is a strong person.
Morihiro Saito and Morihei Ueshiba – 1954
Q: When the opponent is an older person, or someone who’s body is
stiff, no matter how skillful one is their way of falling will be unnatural –
don’t they ever get injured?
A:
There are often people who take pride in injuring others during Aikido
training, but if one does it carefully they can become skillful without causing
injury. The Founder almost never injured anybody! He taught us like beginners
until our ukemi gradually became skillful and then skillfully led us into the
bigger throws. When people like children fell he would put his hand under their
head as he threw – it was really tender behavior.
As
to other stories… Aikido begins with hanmi. If one steps forward, if one steps
backward, if one opens or moves forward. I had in experience related to this.
At
one time I was employed by the Japan National Railway. The tracks have inbound
lines, center lines and outbound lines. On that day, I went out for a task at
an engine that had stopped on the center line. At that time the steam engine
was puffing steam, and since it was the middle of winter I couldn’t see
anything at all. I was standing just at the point of the inbound line. Then,
and I don’t really understand this myself, I suddenly jumped out of the way and
landed in left-hanmi. You see, I had moved my body out of the way of the train.
In that instant, an express train from Aomori passed by on the inbound line.
Q: Wow!
A:
The crewmen knew that I was out there, so they thought that I had already been
run over. But I was just standing there calmly, so both the crewmen and the
people standing on the platform were astonished. I still don’t understand how
or why I jumped out of the way or how I sensed that the train was coming. Once
the express train passed my knees started knocking. How many years ago was
that…it was in my twenties. There are times when human being’s knees actually
knock, aren’t there? I was the one who was most surprised.
Q: That was a at a time when you had not yet mastered Aikido,
right?
A:
But that jumping tai-sabaki matches Aikido methods. I really don’t understand.
What did I sense, it was just a short instant of time – conversely, if I had
sensed that something was coming I think that might have become unable to move!
It must be because I didn’t understand what was happening that I was able to
move out of the way.
Q: Did you gain a deeper understanding of the principles of
Aikido from that time?
A:
Well, it’s something that could have happened to anybody…
Q: Or it may be that it was one of those spiritual experiences
that we spoke about previously, don’t you think?
A:
I think so. If I had put that tai-sabaki into practice after I became skillful
then it wouldn’t have been anything. There was one time that I happened to get
caught up in an odd situation.
Q: When was that?
A:
Well, about thirty years ago, I think. One day I was drinking with a friend,
and we were walking down the street bar hopping when there was a fellow making
noise about how his motorcycle wouldn’t start. So, we thought we’d take a look
at it, but when we touched the motorcycle all of a sudden we were surrounded.
They were from some Kumi (Note: a yakuza group) from some construction
site in Asakusa, it seemed that they had been in a fight with some local young
people, beat them up and were chasing after them. The motorcycle belonged to
their group, and they thought that I had come to get even with them. Hey! Hey!
They came at us. Well, we had to protect ourselves (Note: “You have to sweep
off the falling sparks” – in other words, protect yourself from possible
dangers).
Q: How many of them were there?
A:
Coming directly at us there were two people, but we were pretty drunk. I don’t
remember a thing, but it seems that I threw them quite a distance while hardly
touching them at all. When you are throwing, there are ways to throw so that
they can take ukemi, or so that they can’t take ukemi. Because the others were
just regular people who had started a fight….
With
regards to sempai who force a throw even in training, it would be rude not to
take ukemi so one forces themselves to take the ukemi, and then they get
injured. I think that those people who injure others have no room in their
hearts. Those people who have room in their hearts have feelings of
consideration in the midst of their severity and will not cause injuries.
People who cause injuries are practicing in an overbearing manner, and in that
manner there is a contradiction with the principles, so I think that I would
like them to study that area more. I’m not very good at speaking, so I can’t
express it well…
The basic training of Aikido is static training
Q: Well, this has been really interesting. By the way, when I
watch skillful people training together in Aikido they get thrown quite a
distance. Or is it that they are purposefully trying to show something?
A:
Do you see training like that? Well, people who train while taking that big
ukemi are all weak.
When
training in the real basics we don’t allow them to take big ukemi. I throw
without allowing them to take big ukemi and then after they fall we hold them
down. Some throw partway through. Then the person throwing is already done with
their task, and the person being thrown is released there. But in the basics
one holds them down until the very end, one does not release their Ki until the
very end. It’s there that there is a difference in the degree of conditioning.
Here (the Founder’s book, mentioned previously) it is too, in this technique
everybody takes the big ukemi but even in this throw he is holding them down.
This is basic in Aikido.
Q: Thank you for such a valuable discussion. I hope that many
Budo shugyosha will find it a helpful reference.
Published by: Christopher Li – Honolulu, HI
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