Thursday, August 28, 2025

Jissen or Actual Combat raining

  


After having Joe Swift’s book “The Essence of Naha-te” for 5 years again I worked out what a treasure it is to me. I have found whenever I purchase a great martial arts text, it takes me at least 5 years before I realize why it means so much to me.

 

It certainly has much more to do with me than the value of the text. I realize I had much more to learn over that 5 years to appreciate what was written.

 

What caught my eye was an autobiography of Yoshimura Jinzai and his description of the martial  education he received, first at the direction of his father, then what he received from the various instructors he  trained with.

 

I have long wondered at what martial education  on Okinawa was prior to 1900 and Joe’s translation give us such an account.

 

Not that this means it was the Okinawan standard, just what one young man experienced. I am just going to focus on the training revealed. For the rest of the story, well I will let Joe’s translation tell that.

 

His father directed he begin his studies from the family accountant Ishimine somewhere between 11 and 12 years of age. He studied Naifanchi and Passai kata. He admits he was dragged into the garden for classes. That training continued for 2 full years, but he also admitted he often wheedled his way out of training.

 

On reaching adulthood of age 17 he began his serious martial training. It was with Bushi Matsumara and was held at Nan’en. He traveled there 3 times a month with his older brother and another to receive training in Gojushiho and Kusanku kata. While there he also received sword training , Jingen ryu, from Ijuin  of Kagoshima.

 

When he was 22 or 23 he traveled to train with Hiagonna on the beach across from his house.  Later for a year on their estate in Shuri, Hiagonna traveled there to train him daily, in all weather , even on rainy and windy days.The training began at 6pm and continued untio 10pm, when Hiagonna would take a palanquin to travel home.  The training was on the basics of Sanchin and then Pechirin kata.

 

Hiagonna referred to the art he was studying as Toudi.

 

Hiagonna Sensei admonished against “Jissen” or actual combat training, telling him “if you are going to fight, then fight with me.”

 

As a young man among his other studies, he began horsemanship at age 10, It seems to have been serious training and lasted for at least a decade.

 

He certainly studied much more to become a whole person.

 

I offer this brief summation as the only account I have seen on earlier Okinawan martial training.

 

Joe Swift deserves our thanks for translating this book.

This is but one of the treasures contained herein.

More on The Upper Body Chart and the Hook Punch


 

The Upper Body Chart and the Hook Punch

https://isshin-concentration.blogspot.com/2023/04/the-upper-body-chart-and-hook-punch.html

My first night as a student in Salisbury the green belts I was assigned too covered Charts 1 and 2. This began my Isshinryu education. ...

 

I have some further thoughts on this post today.

When I put it together back in 2017 I was just focusing on the way I originally learned this chart drill, but now several new things come to mind.

 

Such as when I first saw Sherman Harrill apply the sidestepping double strike from Wansu kata. He stepped outside the right straight punch and hooked his right strike into the solar plexus as he left hooked punch into the opponents kidney. I had not thought of those strikes the same way.

 

Which then led to me considering the same for the two hooking strikes application from SunNuSu kata. Both are related to the chart drill I had learned. Just never before  in that way.

 

So receiving another answer opens newer doors.

 

Then today I was looking at Dr.Yang Ming-Jing’s Advanced Yang  Style T’ai Chi Chaun – Volume 2 martial applications. There in he shares several cavity strike options for the t’ai chi step up and box ears.

 

He shows the same movement we have been talking about in karate, could be used as

 

1) a double hooking strike into the eyes of the opponent,

2)A double hooking strike into the armpits of the opponent and 3) hooking strikes in to the opponent’s temples. Along with other optional suggestions.

 

One must keep seeking.

 

Well something ( a post ) of someone has got me curious on people's views. How many people train to get hit? How many train not to get hit or many train to dodge a hit and a counter? Does it work all of the time? I have never met anyone that trains to get hit. So I'm just curious on others. I'm sure many have seen the post that I'm meaning. But tell me what you think or believe is your personal best way of training and am I wrong about training not to get hit by sparring with a partner that throws a dead swing getting you getting use to duck or move side to side to avoid the impact of the hit.


I do believe that most are here to learn to be better and I have learned from many and I believe have made some friends.....thats always a plus.

 

Ed Sumner In Okinawan Goju Ryu, old school, there is a tremendous focus on "kote kitai," or body conditioning... arm beating, shin beating, thigh beating ab and chest beating... all will harden, all will toughen, all can get to the point where taking a punch won't hurt, and arms/shins in particular can become formidable weapons. What can NOT be conditioned in this way is the head. So that must be well protected. That said, in the course of training, one WILL get their bell rung from time to time. The first time you catch a hard punch to the face will be when you discover that it isn't as devastating as you'd feared it might be. Of course, if that punch knocks you out...… so protect well.

 

Victor Donald Smith We cover much the same in Isshinryu. However I recommend not being there is better than being struck every time. Especially is they happen to have a small blade in their palm, LOL

Motobu Asaki's words: Lose 8 times out of 10

  

Translated with Bing Translate

https://note.com/motoburyu/n/nbc0b008cb022



Motobu Asaki's words: Lose 8 times out of 10

Motobu Ryu  October 28, 2023 20:28

 

According to Seiyoshi Uehara, Motobu Asayu used to say, "If you win with your right hand, lose with your left hand." In other words, it is important not to always go out looking for a win, but to lose at random in regular training or practice matches, for example, and let the opponent take flowers.

 

In fact, similar words were spoken by his younger brother, Motobu Asaki. According to Kenji Marukawa, who was a disciple of Tokyo Daidokan, Motobu Asaki used to say, "Lose 8 times out of 10 in practice." This includes the fact that you should not easily show your true skills and abilities, but it also means that you should not hurt your fellow trainees and injure them, or seriously damage your self-esteem.

 

Fellow practitioners are important to help you improve your skills, so don't easily injure them or damage your self-esteem unnecessarily. If the opponent stops practicing, it will be negative for the improvement of your skills. Therefore, in normal practice, it is necessary to take care to deliberately lose and let the opponent bring flowers.

 

I don't know if this was a family precept of the Motobu Goten, or if it was a universal idea among the samurai (martial artists) of Okinawa in the past, but in any case, this kind of teaching has been passed down in the Motobu style.

 

Needless to say, losing here is not a matter of type of game. It is usually in kumite practice or practice matches (kaketsu). In other words, they knew that this was important because they had been practicing kumite and kaketsu.

 

In the past, the opponent who lost the game would sometimes take his friends and attack them on the street at night. In other words, even if he always kept winning, it could end up costing his own life. Nowadays, you don't have to worry about that, and if you do, your opponent will go to jail, but in the past, martial artists had to assume that this kind of thing could happen in real life.

 

In addition, Motobu Asaki and Uehara Seiyoshi were merciless to disciples who would injure their training mates even in their regular practice. Teaching such people "hands" will not benefit the world, and may cause problems in the future. In the past, when such a disciple entered Uehara Sensei's dojo, he was excommunicated for hurting him in practice.

 

Martial arts aims to reach the way (truth) through "martial arts." Valuing one's fellow practitioners is a sense of respect for others, which is the basis of human morality. Those who practice martial arts must wear it.

Kensho Tokumura Isshin-Ryu Basics

 


 


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vol62pCCK5Q

 

 You have to hit the You Tube selection on the screen


Tokumura was one of Shimabuku Tatsuo’s students


Steve Armstrong one of the American Poineers of Isshinryu


 

Seattle isshinryu kata .avi

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MQn87IhMJ8

 


Steve also wrote a series of books illustrating the Isshinryu kata.


 

Some Thoughts On Gokenki and the Transmission of His Crane on Okinawa

  



Posted on October 31, 2018 by fwlohse

I will assume most of the folks reading this are familiar with Go Kenki (Wu Xianghui/呉貴賢). I have been thinking about him, his impact on today’s karate, and his possible training background lately.

Wu’s history is somewhat unclear, though his impact on the early 20th century karate world seems to have been quite extensive. Through personal relationships and especially through the Tode Kenkyukai he trained with just about all the most well known karate men of his day- Miyagi, Kyoda, Hanashiro, Yabu, Motobu, and Mabuni among others. He supposedly knew Uechi Kanbun from his time in Fuchow and it is said Uechi sent students to him in Okinawa. He knew two generations of the Matayoshi family, and Matayoshi Shinko also knew Wu’s father in Fuchow. Kata of his, or influenced by him, are officially part of To’on Ryu (Nepai), Shito Ryu (Nipaipo), Ryuei Ryu (Paiho), and less officially are a part of a variety of other systems in Okinawa. The Matayoshi family passed down an at least partial system of his, including at least 6 extant forms and 2 others that may or may not still be known. Itoman Shojo, one of Wu’s students, said he also taught a form not on the Matayoshi list, Zhongkuang, or Chukon in Japanese. Miyagi and he traveled to China together and supposedly he influenced Goju Ryu a great deal even though none of his forms were included in it. So all told a lot of contact and influence on the karate of his day.

But what did he bring to the table, as it were? It is impossible to know for sure, as no one has any clear documentation on his teachers or his system. Everyone agrees it is “White Crane”, but what white crane? It is a very good bet that he taught Ming He, 鳴鶴拳, Singing or Crying Crane, at least based on the forms he taught. Baibulien/八歩連 (Happoren), Ershiba/二十八(Nepai), and Zhongkuang/中框(Chukon) are all Ming He forms, and not to my knowledge taught together in any other system. The patterns of his Ershiba and Baibulien bear a great deal of resemblance to the extant Ming He versions, which is additional back-up for this idea. But other than that? There is very little information available, so it is hard to know.

I can’t help but wonder why? Lineages are important on Okinawa. He lived at a time when people were documenting their arts and formalizing and writing down all sorts of things. Yet we have next to nothing on Wu even though he was considered to be such an important influence on so many. I know I talk about my teachers around the dojo, on both personal and training levels. I take some pride in my lineage and have strong attachments to my teachers. So does every other martial artist I know. But there is no record from anyone he trained with of exactly who Wu’s teachers were, or even what the name of his art was. He had a few direct students, people like Anya Seisho and Itoman Shojo, but it is surprising that they never learned (or passed on) any background of the system they were practicing- what it was or who it came from. Not even the Matayoshi family, who may have learnt and kept more of his system than anyone, seem to have any idea who Wu’s teachers were besides his father, or if his art is called anything other than “Shaolin Crane Fist”.

His actual training and teaching show a similar pattern. Wu knew all the important karate people of his day. He is given credit for influencing many of them, in particular Miyagi, Kyoda, and Mabuni. But even though people talk about him a great deal, outside various versions of a form with the “crane wings” posture, a posture not really even that emblematic of Singing Crane, his actual concrete impact seems pretty limited. He had no students that continued to teach and train, with the exception of Matayoshi Shinpo who certainly didn’t work to develop Wu’s art on Okinawa. A few other people kept a form or two of his, like To’on Ryu’s Nepai (often quite modified like Shito Ryu’s Nipaipo) but they are not core parts of any extant art. There just isn’t much of his actual legacy around.

Looking at what he taught, Wu also seems to have focused on the lowest level Ming He forms. Happoren/Baibulien is the first form, their sanchin, as it were. Nepai is also a junior form. While Zhongkuang, an intermediate form, is mentioned it seems no one really learned it (at least no one who passed it down), though looking at the Ming He version some of its techniques seem possibly visible in the various Hakakku/Kakuho/ Paiho/etc, forms around the island that stem from Wu. But that is it. So if he knew higher level material he either didn’t teach it or didn’t succeed in passing it on.

But most importantly he appears to have failed to pass down the core movement principles of Ming He. None of the kata he did pass down show any sign of whipping/shaking, the base energy of Ming He. (With the possible exception of Matayoshi Shinpo, something for a different post.) Instead, they pretty much all are done with the power generation of whichever Okinawan karate they are a part of. This doesn’t mean that Wu didn’t use this method, but it seems that no one learned it from him, they instead took what they took from Wu and applied their karate methodology to it.

Looking at this together I am led to three possible conclusions:

One, that regardless of his skill he was simply not that great a teacher and was unable to pass on much of his system, inspire anyone to become his actual student, or pass on the core mechanics of his practice.

Two, that he wasn’t that great a martial artist so that while people liked him and his ideas he didn’t have much of meat to pass on or inspire, just some ideas and information that were interesting to the community.

Or Three, that the Okinawans looked at what he had to offer and said something along the lines of “pretty cool. I like bits of that. But otherwise, meh. I’ll stick with karate thank you very much.”

These are not mutually exclusive, and of course there is no way to really know, but they all speak to me of a different relationship than we usually hear about. Instead of a “Chinese Master bringing secret crane technique to Okinawa” we have a friend. A kindred spirit perhaps. A fellow student to share with. For a couple, Uechi and Matayoshi Shinko, a training partner or associate from Fuchow. For the rest, someone with experience they did not have, and insights into “Chinese” knowledge, with all that carries in the way of cultural baggage in Okinawa. But not a teacher, a master, or a bastion of White Crane the Okinawans would value enough to adopt over what they already knew. In short, his white crane was not good enough to inspire the Okinawans to do it instead of their karate. Whether that was due to the art, his ability, or some other reason is immaterial. Simply put, regardless of how important the “White Crane” looms in Okinawan karate legend, when faced with an opportunity to simply learn and practice White Crane, the Okinawans instead stuck with their karate.

Who knows, right? Wu didn’t come to Okinawa to teach martial arts, or even as a martial artist. He came looking to work as a merchant, at around 25 years old. Maybe he wasn’t a master, or a master teacher, just a young merchant interested in the fighting arts. He had some training, and was happy to share it with an active and changing martial arts community in Okinawa, a community of highly trained people who found his ideas and experience interesting but didn’t see enough there to leave their practice to take up his. Influence, interest, exchange. Friends sharing their art, masters or not. Real people interacting and learning. Not what the story is, but seems to be backed up by what actually happened.

 

 

Dojo TokyoMushinkan Great article! My only question is - was crane (and other "stylized civilian" forms of CMA) ever a real impact on Karate before the very late 1800s or even before Go Kenki?

 

Kodokan Boston Dojo TokyoMushinkan I don't know. Long discussion possible, obviously.....


 

Wednesday, August 27, 2025

The Obi Wazza

 

 Shimabukuro Eizo, Tatsuo Sensei's younger brother

using belt grab bunkai taught in Sunsu kata.

(unfortunately I no longer have that photo)

Here is Eizo performing some of his kata’s self defense


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yu_s1uD5Sio


 

 

 Isshinryu’s Steve Armstrong also wrote about this possibility.


https://isshin-concentration.blogspot.com/2015/11/obi-wazza.html

 




Crane Stance, No Can Defend

 

Kodakon Boston – Fred Lohse


Posted on May 20, 2020 by fwlohse

Hakutsuru, the secret crane kata. Hidden knowledge, supposedly reserved for the highest level students of the Okinawan arts. Rare, deep, powerful. And yet, for all its vaunted rarity there is a plethora of “crane” in Okinawa. Seems every dojo or group has their “secret” crane form. I’ve seen dozens. Really. The forms have names like hakutsuru, kakuho, kakufa, hakkaku, paiho, hakucho, and so on, all essentially meaning “white crane” or “crane method”. Many seem to lead back to Gokenki, most likely a Ming He (Singing or Calling Crane) practitioner. (I recently wrote a little about him here.) Others are of less clear provenance. But really, it doesn’t matter. Why not? Because there is no crane taught in Okinawa. Yes, there are “crane” forms in Okinawa, but none are any different in how they are performed than the rest of the systems they are part of and none of those systems are crane.

Seems like a pretty strong position, given the status the “white crane” seems to hold in the Okinawan traditions. Especially in those systems like Goju or Uechi that claim a direct lineal connection to crane systems this connection takes on a power that is disproportionate to its historical weight;  having a connection to “Chinese” roots can be a powerful piece of both social capital and historical validity in Okinawa. But there it is. Really. Regardless of the stories told, there is no crane taught in Okinawan karate. Perhaps I should explain why this is true. The answer is pretty simple. Energy and power.

Fujian’s White Crane systems use particular types of power generation and specific body energies. That sound esoteric but it isn’t, it just means they train one to move and hit in certain ways. Two of the most common of these are whipping and shaking. They are not present in Okinawan karate. Both of these in general require elements of movement that break fundamental karate rules. To whip you have to move your arms in curves, not lines, extend 100%, no holding back that little bit at the elbow, and drop all power at impact, so no kime. To shake you often have to lift your elbows instead of protecting your ribs, again use 100% extension, and you cannot chamber or “lock in” with kime. There are plenty of other mechanical reasons, those are just examples. There are also technical and strategic examples, as well as postural and movement examples, as well as training method examples, but this is enough for now.  There are similar terms used- some Shorin schools “whip”, for example- but it is not whipping in the Crane sense.

 

 



Crane Stance, No Can Defend

The point is (with the possible exception of Matayoshi Shinpo, a discussion for a different post) I have yet to see an Okinawan crane form being done with crane energy. Without the energy it is simply not crane. I think one real issue here is a basic misunderstanding of the place of kata, form. The reason the Okinawan crane forms are called crane is because they conform to certain ideas about what crane is. They look “crane like” with the open “wings” posture and finger tip and wrist techniques. Perhaps they are done “softer”, and usually contain one-legged “crane stances”. But the issue, at least from a crane practitioner’s perspective, is that these things have little to nothing to do with crane. Crane is about the power generation and strategy. The techniques in the forms are based on that, the crane is not based in the techniques. It doesn’t matter what it looks like, it matters how it is done.

So no crane. Okinawan karate with crane names, but not crane. To be clear, this isn’t bad. That would be like saying a Ferrari is bad compared to a Lamborghini. Both are pretty nice cars. They are just not the same car. Using Ferrari parts to repair your Lamborghini would not work well. Using karate energy to do crane technique works equally well. And vice versa. Thinking about The Secrets In Kata in this light, I think most of the “crane” forms in Okinawa are rather disappointing, at least if you are expecting special secret knowledge that will make you a more powerful martial artist. They don’t hold anything more than the karate systems they are a part of. They don’t really seem to add much. Except some cool factor, I guess. (Never underestimate cool factor…)

Of course that doesn’t take away from these systems! I love my Goju. It is a powerful and effective art. To return to the car analogy, I would be pretty happy driving a Lamborghini, and someone else driving a Ferrari doesn’t take away from how nice my car is, it just tells me there are other nice cars on the road. Okinawan karate has its own fundamentals, methods of power generation and movement, things that make it unique (in all its variation). Crane isn’t karate either! One is not better. But unfortunately that is part of the secret “crane”, the idea that it is somehow better. (An ancient Chinese secret.) Turns out this is an idea that is hard to defend, particularly when that crane is the same karate in a slightly different shape.

不抖不

This is a saying from Ming He, Singing Crane. It roughly translates as: if it doesn’t shake/whip, it’s not Crane. It refers to the way Singing Crane (and, in my experience, Feeding Crane, albeit slightly differently) generates power, through variations on a shaking or whipping energy that is both highly distinctive and quite effective. The saying means that regardless of any other elements of practice, if you are not using this shaking/whipping you are not doing crane.

 



One day when Ernie was giving us a clinic on Eagle Claw, Fred and several of his students attended too. Later in the day to give Ernie a break all of us did various kata for Ernie,

 

Fred did the Crane form he studied under Matayoshi. We videoed it and later that evening Ernie and I watched it. Fred was using the same energy release as Matayoshi used in earlier videos. Ernie clearly felt it was the best Crane form done by a non-Chinese individual he had ever seen.

 




Fred also trains regularly with a Taiwanese White Crane instructor.

Kata beginning and ending at the start point (kiten) in Isshinryu

 

 Annonkan Isshinryu Karate - 安穏館一心流空手

The topic of kata beginning and ending at the start point (kiten) along the embusen seems to be popular as of late. Though some lineages have adopted the practice, adjustments to the movements having been made at some generation during their reception of the kata, it was not a concept taught by Shimabuku Tatsuo Sensei as a matter of principle. The kata shown here do not have an inherent symmetry in their design which leads one to end where they began. Seisan, Naihanchi, Sanchin, and Chinto to follow

 




This is brilliant I wish I had thought of this. It makes the  case I was talking about earlier was Chinto kata.


 

And here are the other kata.

 




 

Kitaya Ryo

 

It is a storyless current of Kitaya ryo.

 

In the center of the video is Joe Swift

the director of the Tokyo branch,

who is second only to the director of The Heartless Museum.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2bmI1VbyS0


 

 

Dojo TokyoMushinkan Yes! Online translation software fails to recognize, ummm, words... Here is what it really says: Chatan Yara no Sai. This it the Chatan Yara no Sai passed on in Mukaku-ryu (*). In the center is Mr. Joe Swift of the Tokyo Branch, second in command to the chief of the Mushinkan. :D



* This is not Mukaku-ryu, which is a 400 year old short sword system. The uploaded of the video made a mistake.

 

Victor Donald Smith I but do the best I can...LOL

Dojo TokyoMushinkan I on the other hand, need Carroddee lessons!


Ota Sensei Eihachi Hanshi on Kama

 

Ota Sensei Eihachi Hanshi is featured here in Black belt magazine in 1983. He is also one of the foremost experts in Kobudo. He is demonstrating the Kama in this article.













Tomari Seisan - 1968 Version by Seiyu Oyata

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTJadRDPx1s


 

 

 

This is a very early version performed by Taika Seiyu Oyata on his first visit to the United Stats (Kansas City Metropolitan Area). Taika refined this kata for years and the 2012 version of the kata is much more precise and focused on things like force efficiency. At any rate, still a great view for historical purposes

 

 

John Kerker Jerry Holt Sensei was in Okinawa training at Akamine Hiroshi Sensei dojo training Kobudo and he asked him to show him one of his Karate kata....he did Isshinryu Seisan .... Akamine Sensei response was, " middle Island Seisan". Meaning most people in the middle part of Okinawa did the kata very similar....it was interesting he didn't label it by style, but rather by region.....

 

Richard Ruberto I was told karate outside of Naha was considered peasant people's karate. People outside of the main city couldn't possibly have better karate or kobudo. Not sure if that thought exists today.

 

Richard Ruberto It seems Tomari version is nothing like ours. Our roots are in Kyan and Motobu lineage.

 

David Rayburn Richard Ruberto, didn't Tomari te become a part of Shorinryu? This version of Seisan has some moves in it very much like what we do. Not looking for an argument, but I see a lot of similarities.

 

Richard Ruberto David Rayburn take a look at the Kyan lineage Seisan. Tatsuo learned from Kyan. I posted their version on my page. I have no idea if Tomari ryu was part of Shorin ryu. Today on Okinawa the Regokai put Isshin ryu under Shorin ryu but that does not mean we are Shorin.ryu. I respectfully don't agree with that Tomari Seisan looks like ours.

 

David Rayburn Richard Ruberto I saw it, and it looks like ours, no doubt, but Kyan and Motobu are both from Tomari te, so I am not saying that it is exactly our Seisan, and I am sure some things were added to make what ours is, but I can see the basic structure of our Seisan.

 

Richard Ruberto David Rayburn You prompted me to read up and yes there is a connection with Motobu and Kyan with Tomari ryu. Nice to learn something new. Thanks sir.