Shorin Ryu 1985
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOS2EHhX8HE
Searching for more information about Haruku Nakama I've found this: "Haruku Nakama was a student of Bunei Okuhara, and it was Nakama sensei who was head instructor of the U.S. Naval Base's Gym in Yokosuka Japan, where Jeff White, learned Okuhara-ha Shorin-Ryu in the early 1970s. Jeff White, who now goes by the name Chance White, and who ran for president in 2012 in the state of Idaho". Here is an old footage with Jeff White showing some katas taught by Nakama Sensei.
PASSAI Sensei Jeff White demonstrates Passai kata. The Haraku Nakama set of shorin-ryu forms are similar to the Seibukan forms of Zenryo Shimabukuro and the Shorinji-Ryu forms of Joen Nakazato, as both schools practice the seven Chotoku Kyan forms: Seishan, Ananku, Wanshu, Gojushiho, Chinto, Passai and Kushanku https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bu47fdSrpas
Bruno Ballardini And here is Jeff White more than ten years later (I can imagine that the video above was before 1985). A short explanation of the Passai kata. You can notice more clearly the typical movements of Haruku Nakama's style.
Harry Skelter amazing these "whoa have you seen this?" things we used to share between each other via a worldwide underground network only by dubbing video and mailing it off is now available via a few keystrokes! ..and most interesting to actually see how principles held subtly in kata can be lost/masked/buried in just one or two transmissions - the kata may remain eminently recognizable, but now stripped of many of the secrets that made them effective as teaching tools.
Victor Donald Smith The cut up sections available the last 20 years did not include that kata. It is a version of seiuchin,
Zentokukai Toude Kyan did not pick up any real Sai kata thus all his students either did not focus on the Sai or made them up or borrowed. I had seen these years ago and also said to myself "seiunchin". In the Seibukan Dojo Shimabukuro who was a direct student of Kyan had them do a Sai kata based on Passai in lew of a real Sai kata.
Victor Donald Smith In Isshinryu Shimabuku Tatsuo created a kata Kyan No Sai, later he developed his Kusanku Sai and incorporated a piece of his Kyan no Sai as the ending.
Andy Rodriguez Zentokukai Toude said "In the Seibukan Dojo Shimabukuro who was a direct student of Kyan had them do a Sai kata based on Passai in lew of a real Sai kata." Why? For what purpose? 1. Was it to add a different aspect to training. 2. Or - For conditi...See More
Victor Donald Smith Taira Shinken was known to have individuals he worked with to perform kobudo based on kata they knew so they would focus on the handling of the weapon and not worry about the embusen of the form. I have seen other kata transformed into kobudo for decades, this may have been its genesis. Not to say this is how he taught his students. but perhaps something for those he shared with.
Raymond Dickey Looks like tonfa/tuifa instead of sai to me in the first sequence.
Andy Rodriguez I do not 100% agree with Nathan Johnson's theory in his book "The Enigma of the Karate Kata and The Corollary of Modern and Post-modern Interpretation" , but it does make me wonder whether it warrants further research? Is it possible that the past Ma...See More
Donnie Hayhurst The sai kata is a similar variation of the sai kata in the Okinawa Seidokan system. We had no formal name for it and just called it for years Sai Kata. Then about 1995 we put our instructors name on it and called it Toma no Sai, since it was his rend...See More
Here is Shian Toma performing the Sai Kata of Okinawa Seidokan. Time frame is the mid 1960's. If anyone knows the lineage of this Kata and its formal name, I would greatly appreciate. http://youtu.be/IRAu-ARB3go
Matt Perlingiero I really hope Nathan Johnson's theory isn't entertained here at all. It's like, the antithesis of what this group is here for.
I'm not any type of authority for Taira's RKHS, but I thought that he collected the kata and the kihon kumite for the weapons, and it was Inoue Motokatsu who developed the kumite. They are available for viewing on Youtube regardless.
Andy Rodriguez Hi Matt, I don't buy Nathan Johnson's theory, but I do want answers to the purpose/approach of past Karate/Kobudo practices. This group is about Ryukyu Martial Arts Research and General Discussion. For me, it is important to be open to all points of v...See More
Andy Rodriguez I had a side bar email discussion with a budoka I hold in very high regard. You see I must confess that I just recently learned about Nathan Johnson's theory, but something clicked from my past training. During past few years when traveling for wor...See More
Tom Story Another thing to consider is an indoor bo. If you make yourself a bo ( or have it made ) and have it about a meter ( a yard ) or so in length you will find that all techniques can be done with it. All you lose are the striking ends & who really needs them for practice. No it is not perfect but it is better than nothing.
Andy Rodriguez Hi Tom, Yes. I am familiar with this method. Besides my continued training in Shorin Ryu and Kobudo, I also train Shindo Muso Ryu Jodo. So, when inside the house I will occasionally pickup of the jodo and to practice my bo kata if I am not able to train in the dojo or outside. This is not exactly the main point of this discussion, but I appreciate your input. Best Regards, Andy Rodriguez
Angel Lemus Andy is quite the Jodo man. In spanish to "Jodo" has a whole nother meaning- but that is another story.
Andy Rodriguez Hey now Sensei Lemus! Those are fighting words:). See you in Myrtle Beach this October! Btw We are visiting the famous nutcracker Sensei in West Chester next week! Adios Amigo!
Robert Young Sakimukai Sensei haven t seen him in nearly 17 years, best regards..just an awesome teacher!
Matt Perlingiero Johnson's theory really doesn't hold any water if you sit and think seriously about it.
The main problem is that people who support it (including Johnson) are confusing capacity for intent. When you replace one weapon with one that has similar properties, I think it's pretty obvious that you can have success in using it in such a way. You could even have great success. You have no idea how many nails I have pounded in with a wrench. I'd go so far as to argue that was the original intention of the wrench, and people have been missing out.
Do the empty hand kata have the capacity to be used with weaponry? Yes. That's not in dispute. In fact, it's logical to assume that quite a few movements have the dual intent of usage with certain weapons like jiffa, or a knife (Kusanku and Wansu have movements that make complete sense to include these weapons), and it would be laughable for a system of self-defence to discount a viable means of protection because of some perceived name-based rule set. What -is- in dispute is that Johnson says that the -original intention- was for weaponry, which he has absolutely no -evidence- to support aside from being able to ape kata movements while holding sai. This demonstrates nothing but capacity which =/= intention. Naihanchi doesn't change when you hold a Glock in each hand, so it must've been intended for usage with firearms, right?
Further, the myth that there was a "weapon ban" in Okinawa is baseless as is generally presented. There indeed was a ban... on firearms. Literally everything else (spears, swords, sai, etc.) was a-okay because they were viewed as obsolete for making war by the 17th century.
I don't have a problem with people preforming say, Passai with sai, as long as they aren't making extremely bold claims about historical validity that have absolutely zero evidence for them, especially when we have plenty of evidence as to what the intentions of the kata are without weapons. That's why I don't think there's any benefit to discussing his hypothesis: it's baseless. We might as well start talking about Naihanchi's original purpose being to fight in rice-paddies if we're entertaining things that run full-tilt away from logic and still manage to stay alive.
Angel Lemus I have to agree with you and Andy. Empty hand forms are different by nature, different footwork, different feel, different intent, and most important different DISTANCING. I see nothing to support this argument.
Andy Rodriguez Hi Matt, I do agree with many the points that you have made. I don't agree with Johnson's hypothesis, but I I do believe that weapons arts can augment empty hand training and vice a versa. Years ago about 2004 or 2005 I attended a seminar given by Dr. Paul Cote. His teacher if you don't know him was Robert W. Smith, but he also has been training Okinawan Martial Arts for years. During this seminar he shared excerpts from Isshin Ryu version of Tokumine No Kun and applied some of the techniques without the Bo with a compliant participant in response to different attacks. It was a truly fascinating theory and seminar! I also appreciated how he was able to show possible influence of Chinese Internal Arts to Okinawan Martial arts. Here is Paul Cote's info.
http://www.academictrainingtraditions.com/bio.html
If there are no actual formal two person bunkai sets that correlate with the solo kobudo forms that have been passed down, we can't actually be 100% sure can we? With Respect, Andy Rodriguez
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